Kashrus
I remember first thinking about keeping kosher. How daunting it seemed. How I took tiny baby steps. I started with not consuming shellfish and bacon/pork. Then I moved on to purposely not eating milk and meat together. When I moved out on my own and had to kasher and toyvl the entire kitchen, things at home were at Artscroll standards. Of course, I was still saying that I would eat dairy out. Or fish. But I didn't. I'm not dating, so eating out regulary to restaurants hasn't been a part of my life. I do occasionally eat by my mother, but not fleishig. I haven't yet kept 6 hours after meat to have milk-but I'm aware of it-I'm working up to that. So, when and how did I become kosher with these attitudes? When did I become a kashrus snob?
I stayed by my aunt in NY, whom I always boast has a kosher kitchen. Well, it's not as kosher as I thought. Milk and meat are mixed in the dishwasher. Most of the foods don't have hekshers. I guess that could be passable for cereal, but not for cheese. I found myself uncomfortable. Partly in eating there, but what felt worse was feeling that I had to say to my only Jewish relative "I just can't eat here." I didn't want to offend her, but somehow my levels surpassed hers. I ate sushi at one non-kosher restaurant while there, and even that didn't sit well.
I'm having an issue with something BT's may have encountered. How does one not offend friends and family who don't hold to the same (or any) standards? It is easier to tell my mother that I can't eat by her than it is to tell my aunt. My mother is at least trying-she buys kosher cheese/dairy and glatt hot dogs for the kids and keeps a special pan. I taught her to read hekshers and she listened. Her biggest mistake was getting Triangle K lemonade-not a huge deal. In my aunt's kitchen, I just wonder what the point is. I feel as though I'm being to harsh on another Jew...
posted by Above Rubies @ 4:51 PM
6 Comments:
Mmmmm, the rocky world of kashrus.
I only eat foods with a hechsher, and I don't eat fish or dairy out in restaurants; there's really no reason to. If I were stranded in East Buttplug, Wyoming, I'd probably have to bend the rules a bit, but here in NY there's no reason. Years ago I had a couple of incidents where I was in a farflung place, and went to Howard Johnson's, and ordered the most innocuous item on the menu I could think of-- an English muffin with peanut butter. Imagine my horror when it arrived with two glistening strips of bacon reclining atop the Skippy-- which I did not order or even see on the menu! A similar thing happened when I ordered a tuna sandwich. So, no dairy or fish for me.
I think a lot of hechshers are political; I think that there is mostly no problem with Triangle-K; also, most cheeses these days are made from recombinant enzymes, grown in a lab, not enzymes scraped from the gut lining of an animal, so many cheeses are likely ok too. But adhereing to a hechsher-only policy removes a lot of uncertainty and the slipperiness from the slope.
There's really no easy way to tell people that you can't eat in their home-- other than to gently explain that you are adhering to a very strict kashrus policy, and that they should not take your declining food as a reflection on your relationship with them; suggest they treat it like they would a food allergy.
Hi NJG. My children's school is dairy only-am I right to assume that most day schools are? I can't send anything packaged (a cheese stick, juice box) without a hechsher. I once made a mistake and bought the wrong fruit snacks and the teacher was in my room asking if it was approved. I felt horrible! Same with triangle k, but it was grape juice-and my mom had picked it up. Now, she said if it was triangle k lemonade it would have passed, but not grape juice. Can someone explain the difference to me? Is a grape held to a higher level because we use it for kiddush?
Probably most mass-produced cheese is ok-but not the yummy French stuff I miss so very much....
Grape juice is held to a very different standard than all other juices, because grape juice falls into the category of wine, which obviously is also made from grapes. Wine, and grape juice, has a diferent criteron for kashrus: of course, being a fruit, there is nothing inherently unkosher about GJ or wine any more or less than other fruit juices. However, there is something called "yayin nesech", lit. "poured wine", or wine that could be used for idolatry. In Biblical and later times, pagans and other idol-worshippers would use wine as an integral part of their idol worshipping and service. Any wine that was touched by a gentile was then considered to have potentially been used or designated for idolatry and was prohibited for kosher use. "Kosher" wine is wine that has been produced start to finish under Jewish auspices.
It's a bit more involved, and I'm no comprehensive expert. The gemara (Talmud) discusses the issue at some length. But that;s why grape juice needs to be kosher, and any other juice that may have GJ as an ingredient.
Funny, I am approaching kashrut the same way you did: last year I gave up shellfish, this year I am trying not to eat meat and dairy at the same meal. Maybe next year I will kasher my kitchen....
Overall I agree with NJG, but:
I know nothing of the reliability of Triangle-K, but it is generally not accepted other than for products which don't really need a hechsher anyway (apple juice, raw frozen vegetables, etc).
Cheese is alot more complicated than most people realize. Generally accepted standards are that it must have Jewish physical input at key stages in production (kind of like wine or chalav yisrael), regardless of the enzymes used. It wasn't always that way - many of the tosafists would eat any cheese, and thus is the basis of tablet-k and assorted non-mainstream independent rabbis who certify lots of cheeses on the basis of their being purely vegetarian. From the sources (talmud, rishonim, etc) it is not clear what makes cheese kosher or what could be wrong with non-Jewish cheese. Animal enzymes were not the issue (complicated, but take my word for it), as the use of vegetarian enzymes did not change their analysis.
Next time you're in New York, drop into Fairway @ 74th where they have lots of yummy hard to find stuff, both domestic and imported. Overall, I think the amount of good kosher cheese out there is skyrocketing.
On second thought, I recently heard from a very respectable rabbi in the field that Triangle-K's problems are ancient history, and all that stands in the way of its being fully accepted is Hebrew National - otherwise it is fine. He also says that "Half-Moon-K" is steadily moving towards full respectability, but that in the process it is jettisoning some of it's more desirable products.
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